Posted: Mon Aug 19, 2024 3:17 am Post subject: Ross steering box compatibility M38A1/M38
Hi all,
having my Willys M38 restored I have learned that the entire steering box assy is from M38A1 - sector shaft (pins worn, so will need replacement), steering worm shaft (also some pitting on the worm gear, but maybe not so bad) and the box itself stamped TL122995 it is also an M38A1. My question is, since I will have to replace at least the sector shaft and maybe the worm shaft, can I still keep the box and replace the above parts with the M38 ones?) Or maybe replace the sector shaft with the M38A1 model and keep the actual configuration? (in this later case, if I decide that the worm shaft also need replacement will be very hard to find and the shipping will be also high since I am located in Europe. Any thoughts?
The larger version of the above images can be viewed in the referenced photo albums.
Also be sure to have these two manuals on your work bench when working on your steering syste:
Always remember that your suspension system can be the most deadly system on your jeep. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Thanks Wes, the steering and brakes are important and one must use good and proper parts for it. It is normal that parts for the M38 and M38A1 have different codes and some have different specs indeed, but some are interchangeable. For example I guess that a complete M38A1 steering box (including pitman arm probably) can be safely installed on M38. Sector shafts are for sure a little different (pin distance) and probably the worm shaft is different too. Also the M38A1 steering box could house with no impact on safety a sector shaft for M38. The scarcity of NOS parts and the high prices could have a high impact on a restauration. In conclusion without impacting the safety what are the options?
The bottom line is simply put: "Do not jeopordize safety (both yours and the innocent bystander) for sake of saving a Dime or a Hundred dollars!" Qualify your choices with a solid engineering supported idea. Mix and match has always been a "Russian Roulette game!" If it was ever cost effective and safe for two or three different worm gears to use combine into only one the Army would have saved that money 50 years ago! Securing the support of folks you do not even know on web sites and facebook for making an engineering change is not the best move.
Quote:
In conclusion without impacting the safety what are the options?
To not impact safety you must get a valid engineering based approval from a qualified source. How to do this is simple. I'll offer two avenues of pursuit for you:
1 - Take your steering parts samples and data to the nearest front end shop and have them bless your idea.
2 - Send the information you have accumalated to an engineering firm and pay dearly for their advice. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
I totally understand your point of view, but this will happen in an ideal world, time and space. Unfortunatelly I am located in Romania, so the possibilities are very narrow. Still I try hard to restaurate and bring back on road a 70+ years old truck.
So, sometimes I will need the expertise and experience of you people, the proud owners of Willys.
Let's put it very simple. If I keep this configuration on my Willys MC, Ross steering box, sector shaft and worm shaft from M38A1, is it ok? I only know there was an army bulletin that warns not to replace steering box from M38 to M38A1, but the other way around?
My M38 was bought that way from Greek army...
If the parts to whatever steering assembly you have are all the correct parts for that specific steering gear assembly, they are all serviceable and are all assembled and installed correctly by the manual then they might be ok but that depends on whose eyes with what level of exeperience are on site handling the parts and the labor. As I have already said using this site and facebook to get an approval on your desired plan without the mebers being on your site and carefully observing each part and it's handling then that leaves the doubt that can never been avoided.
I have been to many countries in Europe, Asia, Middle east, and Africa and when I interact with their mechanical technicians they are just as smart and mindful as any American mechanic and they are more then just capable of ensuring the correct mix of parts in the correct steering unit will function correctly. They have the ability to complete the same safety inspection I have. Other than the language in the manual and the measurment system used there is no real difference which nationality does the work as long as they are trained and experienced in this type work. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Joined: May 30, 2014 Posts: 3460 Location: Texas Hill Country
Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2024 8:43 am Post subject:
The M38A1 steering assembly is a little different ratio if i remember correctly. And again relying on my previous research the shaft and tube of the A1 is 2” longer. So using the entire steering assembly from an A1 in an M38 the wheel will be 2” further aft.
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