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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Athens, Greece
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 Posted: Fri Jun 21, 2024 3:39 am Post subject: ANother M38 steering assembly identification question |
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Hi again!
Summertime and the M38 is again on the road, and all these years this has been achieved in large part thanks to this amazing forum and help from you all, THANKS!
I decided to replace the steering assy that I restored with a kit and instructions from my 2016 post here. However either the kit was not correct or the mechanic (me  did a poor job...
My bad box is with number T125888 is this correct ?
I have located a possible NOS with TA122985, IS IT CORRECT FOR MY m38?
Thanks, Aris
P.S. My current box besides being loose, binding and unadjustable, might be the reason for the Dreaded Shimmy that has been haunting me since day one. I've tried replaced ALL other parts and made ALL adjustments on the issue based instructions from my previous posts but to no avail, so still the damper shock is on the car. I hope with a new steering ass i wont need it!
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Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
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4x4M38
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Joined: May 30, 2014
Posts: 3459
Location: Texas Hill Country
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| Posted: Fri Jun 21, 2024 7:51 am Post subject: |
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Aris,
The numbers you list are for the box casting in which the parts are assembled, not the complete assembly.
The early and late M38 box was TA122885.
The Ross assembly until MC31337 was TA13077, WO-801691, Ord 7375345.
After MC31337 the assembly was TA13084, WO-804384, Ord 7412447.
Both assemblies used the same box.
There was no change in steering ratio.
Your TM’s should provide you with the necessary parts.
_________________
Brian
1950 M38
MC11481
http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=album372&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php |
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wesk
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Joined: Apr 04, 2005
Posts: 16365
Location: Wisconsin
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| Posted: Fri Jun 21, 2024 11:50 am Post subject: |
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It would be interesting to find out which gear box housing casting number became which ORD 9 gear box Housing part number. The only place these two numbers would ever show up together is in a factory blueprint or a NOS (NEVER BEEN OPENED/SEALED) box with the contract data stamp still on it showing the ORD 9 Housing assembly part number.
The most common gearbox housing casting number found on the M38 is TA122885. The cover on this box had casting number TA125999.
Ryan's M38 Book lists this housing as the only one used on the M38.
If this is true then all M38 ORD 9 listed housing assemblies WO# 801720 would be casting number TA122885 & have cover casting # TA125999. The other M38 ORD 9 Housing mentioned is the bare housing without cover and hardware WO# 801711 which would still be the same bare housing casting number TA122885.
Now Aris has found a housing casting # TA122985 and his old box TA125888 and I can't help noticing neither is the correct casting for the M38.
Ross Steering gear boxes found their way into dozens of different make/model Farm tractors and other commercial vehicles for a half centuryt so without factory blueprints it will be extremely difficult to pinpoint a useable gearbox unless we stick to the known common casting number.
As already mentioned above and also in the printed Ross Gear Manuals many share many parts common with other model numbers.
With all this info the safe corridor to follow is a TA 122885 gear box casting and then insure the individual parts listed in the M38 ORD 9 for either the early steering gear ORD 9 Assembly Ross Gear# TA13077 or the late Steering Gear ORD 9 assembly Ross Gear # TA13084. There are
Early Gear Assy M38 ORD 9 page 258 Fig 14-2.
Late Gear Assy M38 ORD 9 page 259 Fig 14-3.
The parts specific to each of these are listed on the pages 262 thru 269 and are ID'd by the veh. serial numbers listed for their use.
I will mention the M38A1 steering gear assembly casting is casting number TL122995.
M38A1 Casting
Top installed view of M38A1 casting vs M38 Casting.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php |
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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Athens, Greece
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| Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2024 10:04 am Post subject: |
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Thank you both for the information!
I enquired about the # TA122985 that I am lucky to have found locally and have been told it is NOS (!) that has been bought from the Greek army surplus stock.
For me bringing parts from the US means customs duties on the invoice amount, where shipping is added in order to calculate the fees depending on the description. Additionally, shipping a complete very long steering assy is difficult because not all venues will accept the length. I brought a steering assy for another classic way back and it was very hard to do so I believe I'm lucky with this find.
I only wonder if this particular one might be for the M38A1 or another military classic but if it will work on my M38 it is just great, what do you guys think?
The price is right and if it turns out to actually be a NOS never before mounted unit, maybe I can give you experts some insight, as I honestly get confused with the part numbers at this age!
Aris
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Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
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4x4M38
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Joined: May 30, 2014
Posts: 3459
Location: Texas Hill Country
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| Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2024 10:44 am Post subject: |
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I would humbly suggest Aris take a very close look at that box casting number.
It is one number off from a stock M38 box.
Filth and grime can sometimes cloudy our first impressions of parts.
As far as the M38A1 steering assembly. Although the box will physically bolt in place of the stock M38 box, the ratio is different, and if I remember correctly the rod and tube are longer on the A1 unit.
Not a terrible problem, but it means the wheel will sit further aft. Note also the driver seat frames are different between the two vehicles. Perhaps this was partially to move the driver two inches aft.
Just my two cents…
_________________
Brian
1950 M38
MC11481
http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=album372&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php |
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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Athens, Greece
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2024 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| 4x4M38 wrote: | I would humbly suggest Aris take a very close look at that box casting number.
It is one number off from a stock M38 box.
Filth and grime can sometimes cloudy our first impressions of parts.
As far as the M38A1 steering assembly. Although the box will physically bolt in place of the stock M38 box, the ratio is different, and if I remember correctly the rod and tube are longer on the A1 unit.
Not a terrible problem, but it means the wheel will sit further aft. Note also the driver seat frames are different between the two vehicles. Perhaps this was partially to move the driver two inches aft.
Just my two cents… |
Thanks Brian, I've asked the seller to open the box and make sure there is no rust on the innards and send me pics as well for me to post here , meaning I'll have to remember how to do this !!!!![/img]
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Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
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wesk
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Location: Wisconsin
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Ryan_Miller
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Joined: Apr 03, 2005
Posts: 1651
Location: Kansas
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| Posted: Tue Jul 02, 2024 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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I don’t think we have the WO drawing for the steering box. I agree it would be safe to stick with one we know came in the M38.
Can you post photos of the old and new boxes?
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Ryan Miller
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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Athens, Greece
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| Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2024 3:18 am Post subject: |
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Apologies for the unsuccessful picture posts. This is another picture I hope will work, if OK I will post the rest. I believe it is a rubber seal for the Steering Tube when fording, of course my old assy does not have one!
[img]https://drive.usercontent.google.com/download?id=1nHtVjlwgfr73wQvH_iYa7iWHMsHzn0W6[/img]
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Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
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arisLgr
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Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Athens, Greece
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| Posted: Sun Jul 14, 2024 3:22 am Post subject: |
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Apologies for the unsuccessful picture posts. This is another picture I hope will work, if OK I will post the rest. I believe it is a rubber seal for the Steering Tube when fording, of course my old assy does not have one!
[img]https://drive.usercontent.google.com/download?id=1nHtVjlwgfr73wQvH_iYa7iWHMsHzn0W6[/img]
https://drive.usercontent.google.com/download?id=1nHtVjlwgfr73wQvH_iYa7iWHMsHzn0W6
_________________
Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
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wesk
Site Administrator
Joined: Apr 04, 2005
Posts: 16365
Location: Wisconsin
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4x4M38
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Location: Texas Hill Country
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arisLgr
Member
Joined: Dec 25, 2016
Posts: 119
Location: Athens, Greece
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| Posted: Tue Aug 13, 2024 3:16 am Post subject: |
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Hi again, I’m ready to post the findings of my NOS Ross assy, but thought it is best if I now start a new topic. Come check out the new post with title “NOS M38 Ross steering assy”!
_________________
Aris
Willys M38
1936 Cord Phaeton
1954 Mercury Monterey
1968 Corvette Stingray
1973 Mercedes 350SE
1974 Montesa Cota 247T
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