Joined: Nov 24, 2010 Posts: 1390 Location: Orem, UT
Posted: Sun Jul 06, 2014 6:50 pm Post subject: Windshield angle
I just got curious about this after putting on my new winter top. Its rather saggy. So I got to wondering about what the windshield angle should be, thinking if maybe mine could be angled too far back.
With the cowl measuring right at 0* reference. Measured at the middle of of the frame I'm getting 18*, passenger is 18* and driver is at 16*. I would of thought the driver angle would be a bit further back than the driver but its not way out of whack.
I think you need to clarify which side you are calling which side in the analysis portion of your post!
Quote:
I would of thought the driver angle would be a bit further back than the driver but its not way out of whack.
Usually the passenger side of the windshield is bent further back for two reasons.
1-The driver has the steering wheel to assist his climbing in and out.
2-The passenger usually doesn't realize that he is bending his buddy's windshield or in some cases doesn't care.
I have never seen a published diagram that included the windshield angle. It would be nice if a holder of those particular factory drawings could enter this discussion and tell us what angle the Willys engineers had in mind. _________________ Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100
Joined: May 14, 2009 Posts: 972 Location: South Dakota
Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 6:05 am Post subject:
Good question brett. There is discussion about measurements on G503 about the distances between the windshield and bows in order to get the top to fit right. I hate running a top on my MB because it flops in the wind directly over your head. The M38 top upgrade to this problem was with the winter top having rods between the windshield and bows including the vertical rods that the door latches to. I've noticed the summer top does not have the pockets for the rods on the M38 also. I expect some flop again. The wimpy windshield on a MB combined with tightening the rear straps all to heck and then getting in a big wind, worries me . It might damage the windshield. I'd contact your top supplier and ask if he knows the correct distance dimensions for the bow/windshield layout. John
I believe that in the final analysis the angle of the windshield will have to be one that allows the cowl seal to function properly and still maintains some tension on the top. These were never meant to be smooth tight fitting highway cruising soft top vehicles. Flapping is a natural act for a military jeep soft top. Soft top production tolerances are not tight enough to dictate a specific degree angle for the windshield. New soft tops are expected to shrink an approximate dimension in the first year. How they are maintained over the remaining years dictates how much more shrinkage they go through. If 180 pound GI's for 20 years hanging on the top of the windshield as they climbed in and out of these jeeps did no serious harm to the right sides of the windshields I doubt a flapping top will.
Summer tops are an aftermarket thing. The military only ran one heavy weight top specification. I still recall my first ride in a fresh M38A1 in 1955 with the doors and side curtains removed in May. They flapped then and still do.
Keep in mind that the fit of the doors is dictated by the angle of the windshield as well. It is their fit and not the length of the top and it's flap that determine your best windshield angle. If the windshield itself is not bent then the primary angle determination comes for the condition and age of the cowl seal and the adjustment of the two latches.
The top manufacturers like old Whitco and Best Top give you a distance measurement from the top rear edge of the windshield to the to forward, top, edge of the rear tub panel for their tops. With tailgates measure the edge of the tub at the edge of the tailgate on both sides.
Here are the Best Top instruction sheets in PDF. The measurement info is on page 3.
Go to Pizzo's page and you'll see that his rodwork dimensions will actually lock in a correct windshield angle by keeping the door' opening verticalrod 90 degrees to the top edge of the tub.
Joined: May 30, 2014 Posts: 3457 Location: Texas Hill Country
Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 4:00 pm Post subject:
Tightening up cloth/canvas......
My father in law fixed up and sold used cars at auction for extra money. Typically the headliners in those old 30's-50's cars were saggy.
They'd spray water with a pump sprayer onto the headliner (in the summertime mind you), roll up the windows, and sit that puppy in the sunshine all day.
He said it pulled that headliner right back up tight.
They ran it t to the auction as fast as possible (hoping the banana in the tranny and and other "fixes" would get her through the line before everything went south.
Well, makes a nice story.
It gets pretty warm in the Salt Lake valley in the summer.....
Looks like 19 degrees on the CJ-3B drawing.
I don't have any idea if all Willys are the same. _________________ Don Norris
Southeast, NC
53 CJ3B F134
59 Willys Pick-up truck
54 CJ3B is my M606 wanta-be in progress (rough)
M100 trailer
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