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willysmjeeps.com :: View topic - M38A1 Battery 22NF Hold Downs
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M38A1 Battery 22NF Hold Downs
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Bob_C
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:47 am    Post subject: M38A1 Battery 22NF Hold Downs Reply with quote

Hi all,

It's been forever since I posted on here. Good to see some familiar usernames (and lots of new ones).

I restored my M38A1 in 2006 when I was in high school. I used the 22NF batteries for it as at the time it was hard to find / expensive for the proper battery type. I made a new weldment holddown for the 22NFs - just simple pieces of angle welded together.

Battery replacement is upon me again, and I'm eager to get rid of these holddowns. Will the 22NF fit in the M38A1 stock holddowns cleanly? I thought I read and recall that some spacers had to be installed? I'm debating buying new holddowns or designing my own look-alike, but properly sized for the 22NF.

Thanks!
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wesk
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quality control is not the best with the battery manufacturers. They do try to come close to the SAE standard battery sizing charts but they are rarely dead on.

I would take the path to a pair of new original or aftermarket hold downs and then customize them for a good fit. A common issue will be positioning of the terminal posts which will often vary with manufacturers and if you look closely at the original A1 hold downs the clearance between the posts and the hold down rod retainer & the hold down standoff bracket is tight.




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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

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Bob_C
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Wes. I agree about the tight fit. Looks like I'm possibly into some sort of modification project.

The proximity of the posts to the metal holddown does get my attention, especially during maintenance. If I did go down a "design a new look-alike" path, I was thinking of introducing more spacing around the posts.
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mdainsd
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you are modifying the hold downs, why not consider a different battery type.
I know people are using the 51R battery in the M38 and A1. I am one of those. I also use them in my M37. WAY more CCA. I buy blems from Interstate Battery. Thirty something bucks each. I have 6 that I have been using for a while now and no issues.
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1952 Dodge M37, 1942 GPW, 1948 FrankenJeep CJ2A/M38, 1951 M38, !942 WC-57 Command Car Undergoing factory original restoration, 1944 WC-51 Weapons , (2) M1941 Sperry 60" Anti-Aircraft Searchlight, John Deere M-gators


Last edited by mdainsd on Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:34 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've seen a lot of people using 51Rs. Any other hiccups to be aware of? Do I need to change any terminal hardware?
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mdainsd
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Other than the hold downs, plug and play.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote


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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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Bob_C
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What is the function of the holes in the welded on tabs (shown in the picture detailing the correct orientation of aftermarket parts?) It doesn't appear to be a fastener clearance hole.
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wesk
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Either lightening holes or bolt holes. I would guess weight wasn't an issue and facilitating the bolting of the brackets if desired is the most likely reason.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

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Bob_C
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right. I just don't physically see any mating holes in the battery box itself or in TM9-8014. I assume shared part with something else?
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wesk
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I just don't physically see any mating holes in the battery box itself or in TM9-8014.

Nor are there any holes in the "L" brackets in those TM's.

Quote:
I assume shared part with something else?

Only the aftermarket frames had the "L" brackets drilled. Neither M38 (ORD# 7348513, WO# 800013 Calls out 2 EA.) or M38A1/M170 (ORD# 8329666, WO#807111 Calls out 2 EA.) original hold downs had the drilled holes in the "L" brackets.

Note: The illustrations of the battery installations in both the TM 9-804A and TM 9-8014 Show the two hold down frames clearly not alike. On the driver's side battery the hold down is displayed with both "L" brackets at the aft side of the battery and on the passenger side hold down it shows both "L" brackets on the driver's side of the right (Pass) side battery.

If the aftermarket drilled "L" brackets are used on some other vehicle I do not know but not on the M38A1/M170 and they would be styled differently on the M38.

Also odd is the MWO ORD G740-W8's removal of both forward (firewall side) angle brackets on the hold down frame in the cowl and only the engine side aft in the under hood box hold down with no changes in the M38 part number. Also odd this mod was never introduced on the M38A1 or M170.








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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php


Last edited by wesk on Sun Sep 15, 2019 12:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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mdainsd
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Something isn't right with that MWO posted.

The directions clearly state "Note: The following procedure applies to both hold down frames

But the illustration appears edited to say differently. The edited portion is in color, where as the MWO was printed n black and white.
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 12:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The edited blue is added by me. It didn't say what I intended it to. I'll correct that. This MWO actually reprints the directions from it's 1954 predecessor issue of this MWO which at that time did not include the straight angle addition.






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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was out in the shop today. I was fussing around looking for some fool thing or another. I came across two of those hold downs modified by the second MWO, Both A and B cut out. I remember I was going to throw them out thinking they were Bubbaized. Now Im glad I kept them.
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1952 Dodge M37, 1942 GPW, 1948 FrankenJeep CJ2A/M38, 1951 M38, !942 WC-57 Command Car Undergoing factory original restoration, 1944 WC-51 Weapons , (2) M1941 Sperry 60" Anti-Aircraft Searchlight, John Deere M-gators


Last edited by mdainsd on Mon Sep 16, 2019 8:23 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do they have the 6" long angle riveted to center of the frames on the same side the "V"'s were cut off?
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

Mjeeps photo album: http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=Wes-Knettle&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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