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M38A1 crank but not starting
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willysmjeeps.com :: View topic - M38 : OK, Boomer
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M38 : OK, Boomer
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4x4M38
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Joined: May 30, 2014
Posts: 3339
Location: Texas Hill Country

PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 6:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reminds me of the Little Red Hen.
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Brian
1950 M38
MC11481
http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?set_albumName=album372&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php
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Naugha
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Joined: Apr 01, 2020
Posts: 407
Location: Ocala, Florida

PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2022 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Little Red Hen.

My grandfather was a farmer and raised a bunch of those guys.
Sometimes I helped with the needed ‘processing’.
Grandma’s fried chicken. Yum.
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Don Alvarez
Retired HS Teacher
Central Florida
M38 Project
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4x4M38
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Joined: May 30, 2014
Posts: 3339
Location: Texas Hill Country

PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Surely you know the story. The little red hen wanted some bread. So she asked her barnyard friends help in planting the seed, caring for the plants, harvesting the wheat, thrashing, grinding, mixing and kneading the dough, baking, etc. to no avail.

But, ah, when the bread was fresh from the oven and piping hot guess who all showed up to share!
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Brian
1950 M38
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RICKG
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Joined: Aug 31, 2010
Posts: 1698
Location: SO IDAHO

PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Naugha wrote:
so it can get lonely at the barn.



My brother Bob came back from VN, worse for wear, in '72. We acquired the M38 at auction soon after, it sat for the next 35+ years basically because we couldn't agree on which way to go with it. He gave up on this life, by his own hand, in '09 at which time I took possession and began the process. Every day I cussed him, asked the question "why", did some things to the jeep I know he would not have approved of (overdrive? $&% ya!) Lonely at the barn? Ya but it helped put that anger in a better place..

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keep 'em rollin'
RICKG MC 51986 DOD 01-52, '50 CJ3a
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Naugha
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rick.
Almost forty years ago I too lost a brother ‘by his own hand’.
Struggled a long time with thoughts of how things could have worked out better. PM on its way.

Don
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Don Alvarez
Retired HS Teacher
Central Florida
M38 Project
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Naugha
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Joined: Apr 01, 2020
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Location: Ocala, Florida

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2022 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Working on the arss end.



Cleaned out the last slotted screws & square nuts at True Value.



Hard to find nuts/bolts will maybe be another day.

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Don Alvarez
Retired HS Teacher
Central Florida
M38 Project
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RonD2
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Joined: Oct 02, 2014
Posts: 1572
Location: South Carolina, Dorchester County

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2022 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Don,
Nice work and progressing fast now!

Ok, I'll bite. What's with square nuts on the footman loops?

I had a time finding some of the more obscure slotted round head and slotted truss head screw sizes and had to buy smallest box quantity to get them so I have extra in some sizes.
Let me know if you need something --- or a point to the source.
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Ron D.
1951 M38 Unknown Serial Number
1951 M100 Dunbar Kapple 01169903 dod 5-51

“The only good sports car that America ever made was the Jeep."
--- Enzo Ferrari

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Naugha
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Joined: Apr 01, 2020
Posts: 407
Location: Ocala, Florida

PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 8:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The footman loops on my jeep were attached with square nuts that were roasted & toasted, leading a noob to think they were the real deal. Another one of those ‘assumptions’ I made without checking the TM & posts. They are mostly out of sight, lock tightly without a washer and will be covered with paint.

This will hopefully be an 80/20 resto..... where on a foggy SC morning at a distance of twenty yards, without his glasses, RonD2 will not spot 20% of my mistakes. Very Happy Cool
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Don Alvarez
Retired HS Teacher
Central Florida
M38 Project
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RonD2
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Location: South Carolina, Dorchester County

PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2022 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good to go Don.
I won't show you mine if you don't show me yours. Laughing

And who's to say they aren't original? Not me.
It's not like there's no errors in the ORD9.
Maybe your M38 was built on a Monday or a Friday.
"Hey Joe! We're outta nuts! Run down to the hardware store and get some!"
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Ron D.
1951 M38 Unknown Serial Number
1951 M100 Dunbar Kapple 01169903 dod 5-51

“The only good sports car that America ever made was the Jeep."
--- Enzo Ferrari

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Naugha
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Joined: Apr 01, 2020
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Location: Ocala, Florida

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2022 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let's take a deep dive on rear lifting shackles.
Close?? Maybe.... but does the boy get a cigar?

BTW. I don't grind off bolt marks nor do I 'clock' screws. Cool












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Don Alvarez
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Central Florida
M38 Project
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RonD2
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Joined: Oct 02, 2014
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Location: South Carolina, Dorchester County

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2022 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very nice Don!

However.......I think those shackle (tie-down/lift ring) pins get inserted from the other direction so they can be removed?
As you show them won't they hit the inside of the bumperette before clearing the mount?
I seem to recall seeing a photo in the manual showing it.

And for their little thin "spacer plate"....I've seen some debate about them. I put mine directly behind the shackle mount in between them and the bumperette.
I favor the idea that they're a "spacer" instead of some kind of reinforcement. The manuals call them "spacer".

See paragraph 32 and Figure 20 on pages 44-45 of your TM9-1804B, Power Train, Body, and Frame Manual.
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Ron D.
1951 M38 Unknown Serial Number
1951 M100 Dunbar Kapple 01169903 dod 5-51

“The only good sports car that America ever made was the Jeep."
--- Enzo Ferrari

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wesk
Site Administrator
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Joined: Apr 04, 2005
Posts: 15811
Location: Wisconsin

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2022 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a post I made 11 years ago on this topic:
Quote:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:17 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
The front lift shackles fasten directly to the much heavier frame rails. The rear only attach through the bumperette to the much lighter rear cross member. That is why the spacer (actually should be called a doubler) goes behind the rear cross member to add strength to the contact area of the lift shackle's two nuts.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100


This was OCWD's reply to that same post:
Quote:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 8:51 am Post subject: Spacers Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Spacers are:

3" x 1 13/32" x 1/16"

Holes are: Just over 1/2" ~33/64" (probably 1/2")

I can't remember how they were when I removed them. Not sure if they were between the bumperette and the cross member or between the bracket and the bumperette.




Quote:
Gallery: WillysMJeeps navigate UP Album: Members Albums navigate UP Album: Wes Knettle navigate UP Album: M38 Frame navigate UP




In the 51 ORD 9 the referenced spacer is listed on page 184 about the middle of the page with PN 800817 and in the 1955 ORD 9 it is listed on page 276 3rd up from the bottom.
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

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RonD2
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Joined: Oct 02, 2014
Posts: 1572
Location: South Carolina, Dorchester County

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2022 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Wes,
Not to start the debate again, but...

Paragraph 43 on page 52 of the July 1952 TM9-1804B: "Place a rear lifting shackle and spacer in position on the bumperette. Line up the four holes in the bumperette with like holes in the body. Secure bumperette and lifting shackles with four bolts, lock washers, and nuts."

This is the thread I’m referring to: http://willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=488&highlight=shackle+spacer
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Ron D.
1951 M38 Unknown Serial Number
1951 M100 Dunbar Kapple 01169903 dod 5-51

“The only good sports car that America ever made was the Jeep."
--- Enzo Ferrari

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Naugha
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Joined: Apr 01, 2020
Posts: 407
Location: Ocala, Florida

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2022 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, no cigar? Very Happy
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Don Alvarez
Retired HS Teacher
Central Florida
M38 Project
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wesk
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Posts: 15811
Location: Wisconsin

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2022 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no longer a debate. As I have said 11 years ago and today: "At any rate I agree that the spacer serves no sensible purpose between the lift shackle bracket and the bumperette. It belongs like I said several times now on the front side of that rear THIN crossmember to reinforce the contact area of the nuts."
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Wes K
45 MB, 51 M38, 54 M37, 66 M101A1, 60 CJ5, 76 DJ5D, 47Bantam T3-C & 5? M100

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