M38 or not an M38

4x4xfar · Post by **4x4xfar** » Wed Feb 22, 2012 5:48 am

Hello to the Group from a Newbie,

I just aquired what I was told was an M38.
The Dash Dataplate is still attached and the delivery Date was still visable as 1.9.1952

The Jeep is Flat Fender and has the Rear Tailgate, and a one piece Windscreen.

However, after reading up on Jeeps, everything pointed to my M38 actually being an MB or GPW.
Shovel and Axe on the Drivers Side.
Fuel Filler under the Drivers Seat squab
No evidence of a Fuel Filler ever having been External on either side.
MB style Dash Layout. (Central E-Brake).

I finally got the Paint Stripper out on the Data Plate, and the original Writting can just be made out in part.
The Plate says Ford at the top and GPW can just be made out in the Model type.

Is it possible a Ford GPW could have been delivered as late as 1952?

Did Ford produce M38's ? and with GPW in the Model Type?

I can't yet make out the Serial number from the Dataplate, but stamped on the front Drivers side Chassis Rail is 210671 which would lead me to believe it's a 1945 GPW.
But the delivery Date is a complete mystery.
The Fuel Can also has 1952 stamped on its Bottom as well.

The Windscreen would be easy to replace, but the Tailgate looks original.

Regards

Ian

Jim · Post by **Jim** » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:11 am

It dosn't sound like an M38. Was the person who provided
you that information knowledgeable? If it's Planetary War
Two, it could be more valuable to restore as one of those
instead of trying to make it something it's not. Also, the
PWT jeeps were not as big as an M38/M38A1 are in
several dimensions. Let us know, and send Wes the data
information for the archives.

Jim in Darkest Arkansas

swat · Post by **swat** » Wed Feb 22, 2012 8:25 am

Three quick ways to determine an M38. Pioneer trools on passenger side. Second battery box with lid on cowl next to windshield on passenger side. Hand brake to the left of steering wheel.

wilfreeman · Post by **wilfreeman** » Wed Feb 22, 2012 9:02 am

A picture (or three) is worth a thousand words!

Post by **wesk** » Wed Feb 22, 2012 10:58 am

Here's some photos that should help you decide what you have:

M38 1950 thru 1952

M38 Dash

M38 Patent plate location (will have serial number on it as MC XXXXX)

M38 Grill

M38 Left Side

M38 Right Side

M38 Rear

M38 passenger side underseat tool box. MB/GPW do not have anything under the passenger seat.

__________________________________________________________

WWII MB

MB dash 1943 (Ford GPW very close to this)

MB Grill

MB Left Side

MB Right Side

MB Rear

Note; is not uncommon for post military owners to cut a tailgate into the WWII MB/GPW's.

4x4xfar · Post by **4x4xfar** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:30 am

Thanks everybody for the response.

As I suspected then, I have a GPW which has be made to
look like an M38.

The Photo's have also highlighted the fact that the Grill
has been changed as well. That bit I missed.

Now for a bit of background, I'm currently living in the
Philippines.
My Jeep no longer has the original Engine. Like most Vintage
Jeeps here, the original Willys Engines are long gone and replaced by later Japaneeze ones, because it was (and still is) impossible to get spare Parts.

The Gear Shift Pattern Plate is Missing, the Caution Plate is Brass and is in really good condition, the Dataplate is Aluminium and most of the Writting is just visable in the right light.

The Philippines have a reputation of bolting together all manor of things and normally with little regard to authentic parts such as Lamps, Switches or Dataplates, but the Quality of workmanship of the M38 modifications is of a very high standard, and significantly higher than one would normally expect here.

So the real mystery still remains:

How does a WWII GPW get a Delivery Date of 1952 stamped on the Plate?

It is definately a Ford GPW plate, (not a Willys), which fits in with a Ford Chassis Number which is also in the correct place for GPW.

Is there any possibility I wonder, that a GPW remained un-issued, or was re-issued in 1952?

I have linked some Photo's, so for the Purists out there please look away now, you may not like what you see!

I am busy removing all the Bling, and the Alloys Wheels will be replaced with the Steel Rims when I get the Tires.
The Rims also look to be of M38 Vintage and not WWII.

Ian

[/img]http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj6 ... 75.jpg[img]

[/img]http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj6 ... 74.jpg[img]

[/img]http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj6 ... 73.jpg[img]

[/img]http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj6 ... 72.jpg[img]

[/img]http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj6 ... 71.jpg[img]

[/img]http://s1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj6 ... 21.jpg[img][/img]

Bretto · Post by **Bretto** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:49 am

You've got the links posted incorrectly. Here you go. This is not an M38. Looks like a MB/GPW, as you discovered, with M38 add ons. The pedal set up is not stock. Windshield is a M38. Any way you want to sell that rifle mount?

4x4xfar · Post by **4x4xfar** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 7:40 am

Hi Bretto,

Thanks for correcting the Photo's.
Not sure what happened there, looked to be going Ok until I posted.

I wondered if anyone might mention the Rifle Mount.

This Jeep is quite odd in that it appears to have all genuine Jeep parts.
Whether the correct Vintage or not.
The Wiper Motors and Lamps all have the correct manufacturers Stamps on them.
That in itself is very unusual for the Philippines.

I'll keep you posted on the Rifle Mount.

Difficult to know what to do with this one.
Probably not worth trying to return to standard GPW because of the amount of work which cannot realistically be put right over here.
Might be different if I was in the US.

Probably better to keep it a M38 Wannabe. Unfortunate, but it still looks the part to the untrained Eye.

I'm still curious about the 1952 delivery Date though.
This of course would be the right Date for M38 parts.
Probably will never know what Secrets this Jeep is hiding.

Ian

Bretto · Post by **Bretto** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:19 am

Whats under the hood? Do you know if the drive train is stock?

No matter what you end up doing with it, have fun with it.!

I'd be interested in the one of those fender mounted black out lights to.
-Brett

skyjeep50 · Post by **skyjeep50** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:47 am

Delivery date? - since so many parts have been replaced on the jeep I think it can be assumed that the data plate has been switched as well. Its a nice looking jeep and if it fits your needs and works well, enjoy it as it is!

4x4xfar · Post by **4x4xfar** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:36 am

Under the Hood is a 2.7L Mitsubishi 4DR5 Diesel.
This Engine was also used by Mitsubishi in some of their own Jeeps.

I had this exact same Engine in my Mitsubishi J54 which was itself a CJ3B copy built under licence from Willys (later Chrysler).

As regards the transfer Case and Gearbox, this is all Mitsubishi as well.
I'm not sure at the moment if the Diffs are Original or Mitsubishi!

The Steering and suspension are original.

Regarding the Dataplate, there are of course no guarantees that this is the original, but it is definitely a GPW plate and it is very old.
So I have no reason to think this isn't the original.
But who knows!

Ian