m38a1 tires

henrydes · Post by **henrydes** » Tue Aug 11, 2015 6:22 am

Picked up a 52 M38a1 set up for snowplowing Has a good hard top and bald tires. Would like to know what would be a good choice for non military tire replacement. Thanks Henry

oilleaker1 · Post by **oilleaker1** » Tue Aug 11, 2015 6:48 am

STA ( Specialty Tires Of America ) made in Penn. Super Traxion. 650-16's

Post by **wesk** » Tue Aug 11, 2015 7:45 am

Your planned use for the jeep will dictate which civilian type tire to use. IE aggressive grip tread for offroad or snow use or a highway cruising tread. Also which wheel you are using will influence tire choice as well.

Keep in mind you should stay with the original tire diameter as close as you can if a correct speedometer is in your needs list.

7.00-16 was the original tire nominal size.

whydahdvr · Post by **whydahdvr** » Tue Aug 11, 2015 12:32 pm

Wes, I know it's around here somewhere but since the topic came up thought I would ask again.
Which is better - a military NDCC tire tread for our M38s for off and on road or the civilian-style tire on the original rims but with an aggressive tread?
Thanks!
-Josh

wilfreeman · Post by **wilfreeman** » Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:02 pm

I would say civi tread, as ndcc tread is designed to be useable in most conditions, but not very good in any of them. They are ok on the road, ok in light mud (assured down), ok on duty roads, ok in a little snow and NOT good on ice.

Post by **wesk** » Tue Aug 11, 2015 10:33 pm

That pretty much sums it up. The military treads were meant to do well off road where they would spend 80 % of their time and be adequate on paved roads for the remaining 20%. Now if you truly spend 80% of your jeeps time off road then they may work for you but the reason for the center rib was to keep the tire quiet when cruising paved roads. It did well but also caused serious issues when trying to negotiate ice covered roads. So it was a very compromising tire making it a jack of all trades but master of no trades!.

A good suburban knobby snow tire in a bias ply tire is adequate for all your needs and just way too noisy on dry blacktop.

If my only concern was good tires that cruised the paved road nice and got me off road comfortably then I would choose a 6" to 8" wide 15" rim and put a a set of wranglers on it.

whydahdvr · Post by **whydahdvr** » Wed Aug 12, 2015 3:54 am

Thanks all. I've talked with Rick Lee about this too but always like to double check over time until I pull the trigger.
The jeep is mostly on paved roads - that's what we have around - but does spend a good bit of time on Martha's Vineyard where we have a lot of sand and dirt roads.
So far my tires have worked well, no issues, but I avoid taking it in the snow and rain to help off set risks from other drivers and I'm usually doing something else. They're slowly wearing down and have some old cracks in the sidewall, nothing deep. But they came with the jeep and I've had the jeep since 2008. Eventually I'll need new tires and maybe I'll get a separate set of rims at the same time if that's the recommendation for a better set-up.
To Wes's point about road noise, don't care. I've had quiet and noisy tires on my vehicles, particularly my 4WD SUV's and trucks - more aggressive treads to enable them to handle snow, ice, rain, mud and off road much better.
Thanks all!

DaveNeale · Post by **DaveNeale** » Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:14 am

I have found the military NDs are really squirlly on wet roads. My plow jeeps have good snow tires on them, and my wrangler has separate rims for new type ice tires. My M37 has civi off road STAs for driving around town, and ND on extra riims for truck shows. The NDs on that were down right dangerous on wet roads.

Rick_L · Post by **Rick_L** » Wed Aug 12, 2015 9:02 am

I agree that the NDCCs get squirrely on wet pavement at speeds over 20mph or so (at least they seemed that way to me). I've had them in in snow. Fresh snow they do ok, but they don't seem to like packed snow or ice. Aired down off road on muddy, class VI roads (abandoned NH public ways), they do ok too. Never had my beast in soft sand, but I think that you would want a tire with more floatation than the NDCC in soft beach sand. Since I have a full size pickup and a dual axle trailer, I tow it when ever I go any real distance, so I went with the NDCC for the look. If I had to drive it, I would go with a modern tire.

RICKG · Post by **RICKG** » Wed Aug 12, 2015 10:50 am

oilleaker1 wrote:STA ( Specialty Tires Of America ) made in Penn. Super Traxion. 650-16's

I drive the heck out of mine in all conditions and STA super traxions it is.

Post by **wesk** » Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:33 am

These are my favorite Bias Ply Mud & Snows:

Goodyear's with the old Suburbanite tread

I am hoping they'll tool up in the near future and produce a few thousand.

oilleaker1 · Post by **oilleaker1** » Wed Aug 12, 2015 1:27 pm

I've run, NDT's, NDCC's, garbage made in India mud and snows, and even knobby mud tires. None were as nice and all around good as new STA Super Traxions. If someone has a set on a Jeep near you, go drive and try them for yourself. I've also driven the 215-85 -R16's. They ride nice and perform beautiful, but just don't quite look like a Jeep tire to me. I'm just not liking their treads available and the prices either. It's your decision! John

Post by **wesk** » Wed Aug 12, 2015 9:26 pm

So we are all on the same page:

Here's what the STA 6.50-16 looks like.

Here's what the Good Year Suburbanite tread looks like.

oilleaker1 · Post by **oilleaker1** » Thu Aug 13, 2015 6:31 am

Wes, your mounted picture is a M37 wheel. Those are 900-16's correct? I've seen Power King Mud and snows for the M37 that looked pretty good also. All these tires are bias ply and not radials correct? There are some videos by Jpet on the CJ2A page of a comparison of NDT's to the 215-85 R 16 radials, performing in snow on a CJ2A. Lots of discussion on tires. The made in India Interco Tires I bought were terrible. Out of round, out of true, thin tread in the middle, and the rubber cracked in just a few months being outside. They are the worst tire I've ever owned.( 700-16's. ) The Goodyear pictured is of recent mfg.? Cocker Tire? Anyway, your upper picture is the Super Traxion 650-16. It just fits a CJ , gives a great ride, good traction, and is a good on/off road tire. John

Post by **wesk** » Thu Aug 13, 2015 7:48 am

Yep, those Goodyears are on my M37. They were brand new 6 years ago. They are my preference and whenever Goodyear tools up and makes a few again I'll be first in line for 7.00/7.50-16's and 9.00-16's.

STA (Specialty Tires of America) is the old McCreary brand. They are not a bad tire but they are a poor man's good tire. I have used McCreary tires on aircraft I maintain for over 30 years. When my customer demanded the best then we put Goodyear or BF Goodrich on.

The issue with using radials on our 4.0 and 4.5" wheels is the thin sidewalls. If you drive on city streets and like a little old lady then you can get away with it. The light weight of the jeep helps with radials being used on way too narrow wheels exceeding their sidewall limits but the larger trucks need more width. Getting 8,000 Lbs of M37 rolling around a tight curve on a 2 lane road at 50 MPH on radials when a sidewall fails to stay in the bead set can ruin your day.