Won't start

DFoley · Post by **DFoley** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 3:37 pm

OK...this is strange. I drove my jeep a few days ago with no problem. Parked her in the garage like normal. Whet to drive her the next day and she will not start. The jeep just cranks and cranks and cranks with not the slightest hint of firing. My normal proceedure is to use the primer pump a time or two to get her to fire up. Now even with the primer pump pushing gas directly into the cylinders it will not fire. I feel as though there is no spark igniting the fuel, but I am not sure where to begin trying to track down this problem. Before i start tearing things appart how should i most efficiently start elliminating possible causes. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,

Oldsalt · Post by **Oldsalt** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 5:38 pm

The quickest way to find out if you have spark is to pull a spark plug wire from a spark plug and hold the tip about 1/8" from some bare metal on the engine while someone cranks it over. Watch for the spark, and you want it fairly dark for that. If you see spark you can look for something else. If there is no spark, check for power going to the coil, but is probably time to do a tune up. Most likely cause is a bad condenser in the distributor, and it is probably time for points as well. If there is no power going to the coil, you will need to find out why. On these old jeeps, crumbling wires is a good likelyhood unless you've renewed the wiring.

DFoley · Post by **DFoley** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 7:55 pm

Thanks...I'll check for spark from the plugs first. This jeep has just about had everything replaced and/or repaired, including a new wiring harnes from Vintage wiring harness of Maine. But that has been about 7-8 years ago now. Also new points, capacitor and coil were replaced about 2-3 years ago. How long should I expect these to last. While my jeep is not a daily driver, I do average about 50 miles per month.

Oldsalt · Post by **Oldsalt** » Tue Jul 12, 2011 8:34 pm

Quality parts will last for decades at the rate you drive. I've had my M-38 for 30+ years and never had a problem. Mine gets a similar number of miles. Lube the points occasionally and they will be fine.

On yours even though it has had a tune up, I'd be suspicious of the condenser if it has no spark, but I've also heard that repro coils can be unreliable.

rwbow1969 · Post by **rwbow1969** » Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:09 am

If you leave the on - off switch on by mistake for a period of time you can burn the points, condensor and coil up. It happened to me, lesson learned. Good luck!!!!!!!!!!
Rob

Post by **wesk** » Wed Jul 13, 2011 11:33 am

First narrow down the system causing the no start. Spark, fuel, air.

11cgrunt · Post by **11cgrunt** » Wed Jul 13, 2011 11:44 pm

Same problem i had. I ran a wire from the battery ground to the block. Give it a try. It worked for me. Got me running.

Matt R

DFoley · Post by **DFoley** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:24 am

OK...here is what I had deduced. There is no spark getting to the plugs. I know this because I took one of the plugs out of the cylinder, left it connected to the plug wire and cranked the engine. No spark was observed. So I moved on to the distributor. I disconnected the power cable (#12) to the distributor, turned on the ignition and tested for power to the distributor with a test light. I was able to confirm power is getting to the distributor. Next I touched the test light to the "+" terminal of the coil and confirmed power to the coil. Then I touched the test light to the "-" terminal of the coil and the test light did not light. Am I now correct in concluding that I have a bad coil? Is there another way to more throughly test the coil? Is the coil a part that has to be purchased from any of the "Willys Jeep" parts suppliers that we all know and love or is this a part that my local NAPA parts store should have. I don't mind mind our jeep parts guys except I don't want to wait for 3 days shipping when I could get the part locally today.

RICKG · Post by **RICKG** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:42 am

If you're 24V i dont think the napa guy will have a coil on the shelf..

DFoley · Post by **DFoley** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:54 am

Yes my jeep is 24 volts.

I also just deduced that power is getting to the points. With the coil installed and the cylinders turned such that the points open the test light comes on when touched to the mobile arm of the point set. When the points are closed the test light does not light when touched to the points. Now I'm very confussed. For the test light to turn on when touched to the open points, power must be flowing through the coil. So maybe my coil is not the problem. I'm a bit lost here...where should I go from here. If I more fully understood the mechanics of how the distributor, coil and condenser worked I'm sure that would help!

RICKG · Post by **RICKG** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:25 pm

Go to the downloads section under 24V electrical
systems then get to 24V electrical system basics.
The relationships of the electrical components and
how they work together are spelled out in pretty
basic language. Not a quick fix but it will help with
your understanding of the flow of things..

DFoley · Post by **DFoley** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 1:53 pm

OK... I got her running again. It appears as though the problem was with the points. Apparently the gap had gotten to small and they had got stuck together. Adjusting the gap back to .020 and putting a drop of lubricating oil on the contacts and spring mechanism did the trick.
Thanks for all your help.

artificer · Post by **artificer** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:07 pm

If this is a standard type distributor

a drop of lubricating oil on the contacts

if you are referring to the points that is not recommended @ all so clean off before another problem is introduced. There should be a smear of hi-speed grease on the distributor cam to rubbing block on the points [not being there is why your points closed up].
Also lift the rotor & a drop of oil underneath there then replace the rotor & flex a few times there should be1/4" plus movement of the rotor.

DFoley · Post by **DFoley** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 5:24 pm

oh crap...taking the distributor apart sucks. I have too take the air filter off first to get to the distributor. Ok I'll fix my error. How fast imperative is it hat I do this immediately?

Oldsalt · Post by **Oldsalt** » Thu Jul 14, 2011 5:31 pm

There is always a tiny bit of sparking on the points as they open and close. A very tiny bit if things are working properly, but if you have oil on the contacts it will burn to carbon and may or may not interfere with the contacts. It is the rubbing block on the points that needs lube.

Did you do anything to clean the points contacts? If they were actually stuck together you should probably clean them with a fingernail file. Or better yet replace them. They are cheap and it is good insurance.