Why 2 holes in the front bumper M 38?

DocUwe · Post by **DocUwe** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:44 am

What is the reason of the 2 holes in the M 38 front bumper (right side)?

Regards Uwe

Post by **wesk** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 11:37 am

It's a leftover form the CJ3A production it was based on. The holes are for the old "T" style license plate bracket.

DocUwe · Post by **DocUwe** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 11:49 pm

Thank you very much! Now I know it

The next "file X"-question:
what is the use of the hole in the M 38-rim?

Regards Uwe

Post by **Ryan_Miller** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 8:27 pm

Manufacter's mark to easily identify the military rims from the civilian rims.

Post by **wesk** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 9:33 pm

It has not been determined beyond any reasonable doubt yet. The 1/8" hole is found on the 16 x 4.5" military wheel with the safety bead and without for the later replacement wheel. It is also found on the civilian Willys Pickup 16x5" wheel. The best explanation to date was it helped ID the wheel on the assembly line. But this brings into question the pickup wheel on the same line.

whydahdvr · Post by **whydahdvr** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 8:43 am

Wes, et al, in regards to the pick-up wheel, is it possible that Willy's made a decision during production to use the combat/military wheel on a civilian pick-up due to better durability and construction? I'm thinking of past discussions regarding the seat covers and that sometimes production-line decisions and changes weren't well documented at a corporate level. Just a thought.
-Josh

Post by **wesk** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:10 am

Note that the rim width of the military wheel is 4.5" and the pickup wheel is 5.0". The two entirely seperate parts. Also the pickup wheel came first.

whydahdvr · Post by **whydahdvr** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 11:02 am

Got it. So much for that theory!

DocUwe · Post by **DocUwe** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 12:37 am

Thank you all! Now I can live further

Regards Uwe

Jim · Post by **Jim** » Mon Mar 30, 2009 9:37 pm

Thanks for the info on the two holes!! I know the
big hole in the center was for a hand crank, but
what about the other holes on the left side?

Jim in Darkest Arkansas

Post by **wesk** » Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:35 pm

TomM · Post by **TomM** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 5:49 am

Early M38 vs late M38 bumper:
We discussed this earlier but never had a conclusion.

Hole #5
Early M38 bumper - pre bumper mounted shackle bracket = 11/32"
Late M38 bumper with shackle mount = 5/8"

Has this been confirmed?

Tom

Post by **wesk** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:01 am

We need a good sampling of Sep 1950 thru about April 1951 M38 original front bumpers to be sure. But all the lift shackle brackets used 1/2x20 bolts so I don't see why there would be a different hole size for early vs late.

TomM · Post by **TomM** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:15 am

The reasoning was that with the early shackle bracket being set back from the bumper there may not have been a 5/8 hole for a 1/2" bolt. A smaller bolt would have been accomodated instead.

The sampling of early bumpers would be needed but until then take a look at this picture:
TM9-1804A
June 1951
Page 19
Figure 9

That single bolt on the bumper is not the same as the 1/2" bolt going through the shackle bracket.

Tom

Post by **wesk** » Tue Mar 31, 2009 9:42 am

I'm not always this confused. Now I see the light. Yes the original holes would have been for the six 3/8" bolts originally used to attach the bumper to the frame but when the change in front lifting shackles occurred my best guess is the factory drawing was amended to show the larger upper hole but the bumper part number was not changed nor was the change on the 3/8" bolts from 6 each to 4 each made in neither the 51 or 55 ORD 9. You'll note the 55 ORD 9 shows a supersedure to the 2nd series M38A1 bumper that was introduced to the A1 late 52 or early 53. This supersedure does not address the original M38 bumper vs shackle brackets but would have accomadated the late bracket 1/2" top bolt..

Why 2 holes in the front bumper M 38?

Why 2 holes in the front bumper M 38?

early vs late bumper

bumpers