Oil pressure problem

Post by **wesk** » Sat Jul 13, 2013 7:41 pm

Unlike the Chevy SB you cannot spin the oil pump mechanically with a drill. Therefore you must either fill the pump with oil before installation or pressurize the main oil gallery with oil under pressure from an outside source (usually a pressure pot). Do you not have the applicable service manual for the jeep engine?

cva59 · Post by **cva59** » Sat Jul 13, 2013 8:52 pm

wesk wrote:Unlike the Chevy SB you cannot spin the oil pump mechanically with a drill. Therefore you must either fill the pump with oil before installation or pressurize the main oil gallery with oil under pressure from an outside source (usually a pressure pot). Do you not have the applicable service manual for the jeep engine?

No I don't have one yet. I can fill it I guess. What is the hex head plug on the forward side of pump for?

Post by **wesk** » Sat Jul 13, 2013 10:15 pm

The only effective way to fill the pump is by immersing it in oil until all internal space is flooded with oil. Some have the hex and some don't.

If you don't want to spend the money on a SM-1002 CJ service manual just download the free M38 engine service manual here on the web site. You will be surprised how many of your questions have their answers right there.

http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules. ... tit&lid=89

artificer · Post by **artificer** » Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:06 am

Many mech's pack the pump gears with vaseline....with good oil feed [no air leaks] immediate oil pressure

cva59 · Post by **cva59** » Sun Jul 14, 2013 6:54 am

wesk wrote:The only effective way to fill the pump is by immersing it in oil until all internal space is flooded with oil. Some have the hex and some don't.

If you don't want to spend the money on a SM-1002 CJ service manual just download the free M38 engine service manual here on the web site. You will be surprised how many of your questions have their answers right there.

http://www.willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules. ... tit&lid=89

Thanks wesk. I will do that.

cva59 · Post by **cva59** » Sun Jul 14, 2013 6:56 am

artificer wrote:Many mech's pack the pump gears with vaseline....with good oil feed [no air leaks] immediate oil pressure

So that means pulling the pump cover to do that correct. I might try this. Thanks

RICKG · Post by **RICKG** » Sun Jul 14, 2013 10:54 am

My pump was packed before install. Just the same I used a 8 buck
oil bottle pump and pumped up the system till I had oil flowing to
the filter. Had instant OP on 1st start-up.
See this post-photos on pg 2.
http://willysmjeeps.com/v2/modules.php? ... ight=prime

oilleaker1 · Post by **oilleaker1** » Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:18 pm

If your oil pump looked good (no broken parts internally) something else is still wrong. Stock oil filter, or a spin on aftermarket? You have to have a backpressure type spin on filter, or it won't have pressure. Did your oil spray nozzle between the cam gears fall out? Gallery plugs all in? There are two internal plugs, two gallery end plugs, cam plug, spray nozzle all in the gallery and oil pressure system. The original canister type oil filter has a .070 orifice in the side of the stand pipe to produce back pressure in the gallery. You need to pump up the system and prime the pump before starting. The manual says to immerse the oil pump in a can of clean oil and rotate before installing to prime it. Then a hand pump oil can stuck in the oil pressure line fitting on the side of the block. Pump it until you empty the can. You should have oil trying to come back out while re-connecting the line. The rattling you heard, was it broken internals of the oil pump, and are your camshaft and oil pump teeth all intact?? I would not run the engine until you check all this. John

cva59 · Post by **cva59** » Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:27 pm

Honestly, the rattling i determined was the old generator. I removed the fan belt and now all i hear is a very faint knock. Now, i have only run it one time yesterday for about 5-6 seconds. I'm sure the wear in the bearing coupled with no oil is cause for that. When it was running and had oil pressure the engine did not make any noise. I believe the culprit all along was me. I ran it low of oil and now the entire system is out of prime. So, learning the steps in involved in re-priming everything is what i'm trying to understand.

I have been reading numerous post on here about re-priming but i guess i'm a little slow. Do you guys think packing the pump with vasoline only be enough to bring OP back?

Post by **wesk** » Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:48 pm

Recently my 48 CJ2A lost oil pressure instantly and for no apparent reason. I have since pulled the pan, inspected, found nothing. Distributor turns as expected and the crank appears to be fine.

I just assumed with no oil pressure it must be the OP. I pulled the pan looking for shavings and such, nothing. The dirty oil was clean from anything like that. The 3-4 prior runs it had a strong 40 psi then on the last run it had no OP from the starting of the engine. Gauge stayed on 0 and started rattling so i killed it. That's where i am now. The pan is off and the pump is out and i'm getting more and more discouraged by the minute.

I believe the culprit all along was me. I ran it low of oil and now the entire system is out of prime.

1 - No where above have I seen you confirm that a substitute good oil pressure gauge was used to confirm the actual oil pressure.

2 - Did you check the dipstick when you suddenly lost oil pressure? If so what did it read?

3 - Did you confirm all the gallery oil plugs were installed outside and inside the block?

4 - Did you confirm the cam gear spray nozzle was still installed in the front end of the oil gallery?

5 - Did you confirm you have the correct Willys oil filter assembly with the proper flow restriction?

cva59 · Post by **cva59** » Mon Jul 15, 2013 6:14 pm

LOL, never in all my years of working on cars have i ever seen anything to beat this POS!

So today, i stopped and picked up a hand pump, hose and fitting to try and prime everything back up. First of all, i can barely get my hand on the oil gallery plug (behind the oil pump) so i got a small wrench to fit it and guess what happened? it stripped right over. So i found a small socket and tapped it up on the plug head nice and tight. Guess what happened? yep, it stripped right over. So then i tried the smallest vise grip's i have and grabbed it as tight as my one hand could squeeze it. Come on guys, i'm gonna give you all another guess and i'll bet you will never in a million years guess what happened; YES, it stripped right over. So, now i'm looking at a stripped over plug with apparently no way to remove it. I guess when it's all said and done i will have to pull the #$%#$%^ engine out just to get the oil pump primed. Looks like the only option now is pull the pump off again and fill it with oil. If that doesn't work. I will post a video of it on fire burning to the ground, LOL.

YES, i have no patience when it comes to aggravating crap like this, sorry.

I'm ready to throw a match on this sucker and watch it burn!

Post by **wesk** » Mon Jul 15, 2013 11:51 pm

Just use anyone of those plugs. You can just remove your extra oil press gauge from the rear "T" and prime through there.

If the plug has an internal hex you can use an allen wrench on it. If it has the square protruding head they make square sockets that prevent the stripping issue. If I feel one of these start to twist or yield where I think it may strip I stop and heat it with a propane torch and then wrench it.

oilleaker1 · Post by **oilleaker1** » Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:59 am

The square end plugs of the block can be just as tough to get out without the proper tools. The way I do the oil can routine is to remove the rear gallery oil pressure gauge line from the brass 90. My pump oil can has a tapered tip. It fits inside the inverted flare center hole of the brass 90. I just push it in the hole and pump. When I remove it after about a cans worth of oil, the oil trys to come back out. You quickly re-attach the sender line and you are done. John (PS- you still need to remove the oil pump and submerge it in a can of oil and spin the shaft to expell the air and prime it)

cva59 · Post by **cva59** » Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:00 am

I appreciate you guys sticking with me on this deal. I'm really frustrated over this oil pressure deal when the whole time it was my fault. Me letting it run out of oil was something i have never done in my life, i guess getting older has done more damage to my brain that i could have imagined.

I'll try another plug this afternoon and see what happens.

Thanks guys,

cva59 · Post by **cva59** » Wed Jul 17, 2013 6:21 pm

Just wanted to let everyone know that after i soaked the OP and primed the system, it started up and almost instantly was showing 30psi oil pressure. So, as you can imagine, i'm feeling much better today. Now, i can get back to the brakes and other areas that need attention.

I do appreciate everyone's help and input. Thanks